#205 – Sales Frequency: How do you sell a product that's new to both you and your customers? w/ Maxim Tarasevich

 

 

Full episode transcript: 

​Please note that transcription is done by AI and may contain errors.

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George: Hi, everyone. George here, the editor of the Sales Transformation podcast. This week we're bringing you another episode of our LinkedIn Live show, Sales Frequency, again featuring a member of the Aviso team ahead of the launch of our new Sales Mindsets Intelligence Studio on Thursday. This time, Jesus and Will were joined by Max Tarasevich, EVP of sales at Aviso, to discuss how our two companies need to approach selling a product that's new for both of us.

You can expect to hear a lot more about the new Sales Mindsets Intelligence Studio from us in the coming weeks, but in the meantime, please enjoy the episode

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Jesus: Hello, London. Uh, we are again in the Sales Frequency. Uh, another, another edition of the Sales Frequency. We are getting a bit more active, uh, due to this event we are having next week. But I'm Jesus Llamazares, head of consulting in Consalia, and I have with me, uh, Will, Will Squire, head of sales. Hi, Will. How are we doing?

Will: Hey, Jesus. Yeah, I'm very well, thank you. It's good to be back on Sales Frequency. I think this might be the first one of this year.

Jesus: No, it's the second. We've done a couple before now. Yeah, yeah. But, uh, back on track. We will be back on track. And, uh, we are super pleased to have Max, uh, from Aviso. I think this is not your first time with us, Max.

How are we doing? Hi. Thanks for having me. Well, it looks like you are quite expert on the, on the topic, so that's the reason why we're, we're asking you again to be back, yeah? It's a pleasure.

Max: Thank you.

Jesus: So today is about to talk about how do we sell a product that's new to the market, yeah? And, uh, and, and, and before, before jumping into this and tying up with the...

As you know, we have a, a launch event we've been preparing for the last months, uh, jointly with Aviso. We have that event next week on Thursday in London for the ones that can make it, 4:00 to 7:00 PM. Uh, we will, we will, we'll, we'll share the details later. But, you know, we wanted to, uh, use the framework or the context of the, uh, this new product we are co-launching with, um, with Aviso as, as an example of how to, how to launch a new product, yeah, and how to, how to sell a new product.

So, um, as you know, the next week we are launching the Sales Mindsets Intelligence Studio. Um, without unveiling a lot about it, it has to do a lot about sales mindsets, as you may imagine, which is our core strength. And the reason of partnering with Aviso to build this software as a service module and standalone product is because of their amazing AI technology and experience, yeah, and, and their portfolio of clients.

So, um, and Max, something, something that comes to me is, so Aviso is a, a great end-to-end revenue intelligence platform, yeah? And, and, and before we jump into the sales mindsets, uh, themselves, and, and Will and me can jump into that in a minute. Um, you, you already have some modules like conversation intelligence.

You have sales coach without the Aviso platform already, right? Not, not, not, not focused on the sales mindsets, focused on other... So what, what, what is the focus of, of, of those features that try to analyze conversations and try to analyze and, and, and, and provide some kind of coaching? What are, what are the...

What is the focus of, of, of those features within Aviso?

Max: The focus is on providing guidance, on automating certain things, on ultimately making salespeople as productive as possible. So think- Um, talking about what they could do better in, in terms of pitching to customers, adhering to the best practices, um, giving them insights into how the pitch resonates or does not resonate, to what degree, exactly what, uh, could have been done better, exactly where does a particular salesperson shine.

And then predicting what results they can expect, let's say at the deal level, uh, or for the, for the quarter, and guiding them on how they could improve. And also giving them an opportunity to work with the coaching agent so that they have a safe environment where they can practice whatever they wanna practice, whatever techniques.

And doing it not in a generic setting, but doing it for a particular, let's say, deal, for a specific conversation that is coming up. Because the platform, the AI, has full context about this upcoming conversation, so which deal this conversation is part of, who is gonna join you on the other side, what is their personality profile, what is the history of your relationship or your colleagues' relationships, your company's relationship with this person?

What's going on with the company that this person works for? So ... And what's the topic of the conversation, of course. So taking all of this into account, the system can provide you a training ground for experiencing this call, practicing before it, it happens. And you take as many attempts as you want until you are satisfied with the results.

Jesus: Okay. No, I think that's very useful. Thank you. I mean, I think so, so we could say that, uh, all this coaching is focused on, mm, coaching on the opportunity, the facts, yeah? So this person belongs to that organization. That organization has made a recent acquisition or has launched this new product, and try to connect this, you know, with, uh, with the existing portfolio you're trying to sell.

Yeah? So it's, it's, it's, it's really sales facts.

Max: Yeah. Or certain best practices when it comes to behaviors that the company expects you to demonstrate. Like think techniques or, um, like selling techniques or the way you should be approaching your conversations, the way you should be leading the conversations.

Uh, also on a very tactical level, it's like how do you talk about your product? How do you talk about, um- pricing, how do you do discovery? How do you wrap up your calls? How do you, um, get to next steps that are... Well, first, how do you get to next steps, A. B, how do you make sure the next steps are as effective as possible?

Jesus: Mm-hmm.

Max: Okay. Yeah. Very

Jesus: good. Very good. I think we, Will, you and me, uh, jointly with Consalia, we've been working a lot on the sales mindsets. Um, we, I mean, the sales mindsets are, the Consalia sales mindsets are completely agnostic from any methodology, right? Sometimes I receive these kind of questions like, "Okay, is this another methodology?"

And, but, but, but really, really is not, right? Really is quite unique and differential from, uh, many things we, we see in the market that is more focused on, on, on other, let's say, you know, sales methodologies or other type of coaching itself, yeah? So, uh, because I, I, I mean, uh, the sales mindsets are focused on, on the values and beliefs, right?

Which, which is the drive to, to our four sales mindsets and behaviors. So, um, do, do you think that the sales mindset is something that, I mean, um, is something that takes time to change?

Will: Who's your question to, Jesus?

Jesus: Well, I mean, you're the, you, you, um, you're the expert of sales mindset jointly with me, right? So I- Okay ... I wouldn't ask myself this. Yeah, I'm, I'm just trying to set up the scene to, to go to the next question to, for Max.

Will: Sure. So, um, I mean, from our point of view, and actually Max, what, how you were describing what the coaching tool at Aviso does is really interesting, especially when it comes to kind of guiding sales behaviors, uh, the, the, um, best practice.

And sort of, uh, Jesus, as you were talking, I was thinking, yes, kind of we've, we've approached the same sort of subjects, but in a very different way through our kind of training programs and our, and our research, but we've kind of come together in this partnership, which makes it so exciting because we genuinely believe that, you know, values and belief systems guide behavior.

Mm-hmm. And this is, this research that we've done has led us to codify almost what the sales mindsets are. And for anyone that might be new listening and are thinking, "Well, what on earth are the sales mindsets?" Very simply, they're authenticity, client centricity, tactful audacity, and proactive creativity.

And the- these are four kind of founding principles that clients look for in, uh, in sales professionals, and that's what marks an, an exceptional sales professional to someone who, um, who, who, who is good, but you know, they might not be living all four sales mindsets, if you know what I mean. So going back to your question, Jesus, do you think, uh, changing behavior can happen quickly and overnight?

Well, from our experience of 20 years of consulting and developing training programs, the, um, the, the question, uh, the answer is no. Yeah. Um, it is... You know, w- what we've, what we've found is that, and I think most traditional training companies find, that you train an audience of sales guys, sales leaders, um, and within, you know, 24 hours they may have retained something like 80, 90% of the information of the training that they've gone through.

But you give it three or four months, and the vast majority of the training has been forgotten, and maybe actually one or two nuggets were retained. But does that actually change the long-term behavior? Mm. And I think there needs to be more of a sustained approach. And certainly when we see pure transformation, um, you know, and when we talk about transformation, you are talking about your changes in behavior from a values and belief systems level, from a mindset point of view.

This, this takes time. Mm. And we see it often on the, on the master's program, for example, that we deliver. Yeah. Um, but what I'm so excited about the Aviso partnership is because for the first time, in real time, throughout activities that you're doing on a day-to-day, um, engagement with a client, you are const- you, you have the opportunity to constantly be, um, reminded of best practice or coached in the way that you were saying, Max.

Um, or, you know, suggesting ways that you can improve behavior. So I would like to think in this day and age that behavioral change can happen faster with the advent of technology combined with some of the research and, and, um, sort of best practice so, you know, per- perhaps companies like ourselves at Consalia have identified that transformation can happen faster.

But in short, Jesus, no, I don't believe it happens overnight. Yeah.

Jesus: Yeah. Yeah. I, I fully, I fully agree with this, right? So, uh, uh, I mean, mindsets and behaviors probably is one of the most, uh, difficult, uh, transformation that you can think about. Do, do you hear this kind of stuff, uh, Max, among your customers within Aviso?

Uh, things like beyond the technology, uh, they're having problems with, uh, you know, or challenges around adoption or behaviors or, or, or mindsets transformation. Do, do you hear that frequently?

Max: Yeah, I think, uh, what matters, uh, to the sales organizations that we work with oftentimes is- We understand the behaviors, all right?

We understand the behaviors are ultimately the most important thing because that's how your customers experience you. That's how, that's what they see. But the question is, what is driving those behaviors? In other words, is, what is the most effective way to change the behavior? Is it just trying to say, "Max, stop saying this, start saying that"?

But then the risk is I will sound not very authentic. I will sound like a robot, okay? So that will defeat the purpose of changing the behavior. On paper, I'm doing the right thing, but A, you decided that these are a thing. Okay, maybe let's say you got it right, but the way it was implemented was not very effective, and this is where the question oftentimes comes up, why was your behavior different to begin with, and what is the most effective way to change it?

And to Will's point, it's not gonna happen overnight, but if you go one or two levels deeper, this is where you run into things like values or sales mindsets. And of course, you have positive ones, you have negative ones. I think you guys have identified the number on both sides of the mindsets that impact your, ultimately, your performance as a salesperson.

And this is where we can start being more data-driven, where we can start saying out of a potential library, like of 10 different good, bad values, uh, values, positive, negative, here is what we're observing. Here is what is likely driving those behaviors that you see in the first place. And the good thing about the mindsets, once you have successfully changed it, this change is a lasting change, and it's very impactful.

So it's not easy to get people to change, but at this level. But once you get there, it's, it becomes much more sustainable than a very tactical behavior level change where people just follow, mechanically follow the instruction. This is why we are excited about this partnership.

Jesus: Yeah. I,

Max: I

Jesus: think, I think, I think I can, I cannot agree more with this, yeah?

I believe that, uh, that's part of the reason why the studio, and we'll jump into the studio soon, uh, we didn't want to provide just advice, but a coaching because we need the person, the sales professional, to discover by themself. By discovering by themselves, yeah, is when they really understand. They absorb the knowledge, and they- They embrace this knowledge and, and make them g- uh, for themselves, yeah?

And I think the data-driven you mentioned is very, very important because at the end, um, the tool, and the ... I will come to the studio in a minute, but we'll, we'll provide, uh, data-driven, you know, uh, coaching and advice which will be completely objective by, let's say, a machine and artificial intelligence, and it will be like a private assessment sometimes on three six- uh, 24 by 7.

So it's something that you can get access. There is, there is no human behind or human intention behind. It's just to, you know, like a pure objective analysis and gives you an idea of how you're performing. And, and it's giving you also ratios about how you improving your sales mindset. You will be able to improve your business metrics, your win ratio, your pipeline velocity, whatever, yeah?

And, uh, I believe this is, this is quite relevant because, you know, then it's the first time they will see connection between changing their behaviors, um, uh, impacting the, the revenues. But of course, I mean, so, so the setup is we have Aviso with some solutions, with conversation intelligence, with some coaching.

We have a lot of, um, AI coaching, sales coaching in the market as well. So we have a lot of people around that, but for the first time, and I want to say for the first time because we've not seen anything before, um, we are creating something which is unique. We have co-developed this studio which, in essence, we are taking the best of both worlds.

Consalia working on the humans, and the sales mindsets, and the transformation of these sales mindsets, and Aviso with all their technology and AI, yeah, and, and, and, and access and connections to, to customers. So we are putting everything together, not just the sales business education, um, and all the programs and all the education, I mean, all the, all the content we have, but all the consulting praise we've done through, through customers, uh, proving, yeah, proving all the results that, uh, by changing the mindsets you can change the, the business metrics and the results and the performance, yeah?

But also on top all the, all the technology. So, um, so d- I mean, I know that the studio's gonna be unveiled next week and we cannot tell too much more about that. But, uh, making the both together and, and launching this new product, what ... How do you think this new studio will create additional value to your existing clients, Max, in, in Aviso?

Max: I think it's exactly what you just talked about. For the first time, we can, um, in addition to giving guidance at the behavior level, we can go deeper to the value, to the mindset level, and this is where we can give insights people into those things. And, uh, we will suggest ways for them to course-correct So that they can self-discover and then take action.

And this, uh, this system has been trained to be fully autonomous, so there is no, um, coach, live coach, uh, a person, a human being involved. So you can just work with your AI companion, and, uh, you can focus on whatever you think makes sense to focus based on the guidance, based on the insights that you're, you are receiving.

And, uh, it's continuous, like you said, 24/7. So the more we learn about you, the richer those conversations will be, just like with a normal coach.

Jesus: So we, we, we, we, we've, we've framed the, the, the, let's say the situation, right? So, uh, uh, I mean, coming back to the, uh, the heading of, of that session, of this session is about how do we sell a product that is new to the market, yeah?

So this is a new product to the market. It's unique. Uh, there is nothing like that. Um, it has to be probably properly explained, has to be properly, um, you know, defined what is the USP against the other ones, what are the, the, the benefits. I don't know, uh, uh, uh, what, what, what do you think, guys? Uh, Will or Max, what do you think about what, h- how, how you, we should sell, how we should pitch this new product into the market?

And I know that we've, we didn't, we didn't prepare that question, yeah? So it's, uh, completely, uh, out of the, out of the blue. I

Max: can see Will wants to answer. I

Will: was letting you go first on this one, Max. Um, I just, yeah, I think, I mean, for Consalia, this is, we're entering a very new space. And so there's a lot of, I mean, a h- I'm, I'm aware of the amount of activity that's been happening in the background to educate ourselves around the, around what the opportunity is and w- and who the addressable market this sort of, um, product is for.

But beyond that, w- you know, our challenge at the moment is that we've been working with amazing clients for a number of years who all know us, um, for delivering certain kind of traditional training models and consulting services. And right now our challenge is how do we, how do we educate, uh, our clients- Uh, that, um, of what the opportunity is with our p- uh, with our partnership with Aviso.

And we're having some, um, incredibly interesting conversations that is leading to new, to u- us identifying new personas that we are gonna be selling to. Um, and it's really pushing the envelope for us in terms of, um, how do we, how do we, um, pitch to a new ICP? Um, how do we a- articulate the value, but, but also staying true to our, um, I guess our core, um, trusted relationships as well.

I think that's- Yeah ... really, really important. So there's, there's on the one hand I see it as how do we educate and inspire through our existing customer network?

Max: Mm-hmm.

Will: Then, then the, uh, on the other side it's about how do we reach a completely new ICP with people who perhaps haven't traditionally engaged with Consalia, but a solution like this suddenly makes them a, um, a potential opportunity for us.

Uh, so yeah, you know, it's starting at the drawing board, doing a lot of research, doing a lot of planning, making sure we're getting the go-to-market right, making sure that our, how we communicate, um, across our, um, across our various channels correctly. How do we, yeah, how do we create noise and buzz and, you know, convey the excitement that we feel internally outwards to our customers as well?

Jesus, uh, what do you think? I'm interested to hear from, from the Consalia point of view, what your thoughts are.

Jesus: Yeah. I think, I think that's, uh, quite a huge step for us because we're used to sell consulting, we're used to sell, uh, sales business training. But we've not sold before any, any software solution, yeah?

Uh, of course, the software solution is, uh, is, is a blend of, uh, our sales, our beloved sales, sales mindsets and the technology coming from Aviso. But as you say, many, many... We have amazing customers, really huge customers, some of them. Uh, but sometimes they, they should be a, a different ICP, you know, the, that, uh, we need to contact with.

Um- There will be also new customers or new leads that will be interesting on, on, on our approach. But when they go to our website, they will see, ah, that's a Consalia sales business school and sales consultancy. What they are selling as, as, as... So it's, it's a new, it's a new, uh, venture if you wanna, if you wanna call it.

Um, my peace of mind comes that we, uh, jointly go to market with Aviso, which, uh, they are very good selling software as a service and because it's their core product, yeah? Uh, but I wonder how, Max, do you see that? Because, uh, I see the sales mindsets more better landing into people like enablement, yeah, sales enablement, rather than the chief revenue officers.

Because of these kind of conversations, yeah? Um, the sales mindsets need time to transform. Of course, the studio 24 by 7, agnost- I mean, um, agnostic, uh, or methodology agnostic, uh, purely objective, et cetera, uh, will provide a framework to accelerate, uh, the, the, the adoption and, and to get results quicker, yeah?

But it still is not something that we will get in one week or even one month, yeah? It will take time. So I, I think this is more a conversation for, uh, learning and development or for sales enablement rather than, uh, a revenue officer that maybe is looking forward to, to have, uh, better quarter results on the next quarter.

Yeah. But I don't know what you think about, what do you think, you think, Max?

Max: Sure. I think in general, the timing for this is great for, for a couple of reasons. Number one, there is a lot of appetite to make sure that AI specifically, um, uh, unlocks as much potential as possible. So protecting growth, uh, driving productivity, cost-effectiveness, those things as priorities did not go away.

So the question is how do you use AI to the fullest potential, um, for all of those, um, ob- objectives and purposes? And also you mentioned, Jesus, we do have co- a conversation intelligence capability today. What's happening w- uh, with this capability, um, it has become, uh, table stakes for a lot of companies.

It's like five, 10 years ago, if you said, "Hey, I'm using conversation intelligence," that was a novelty. oh my God, you can understand wh- the next steps that were discussed on a call. Maybe you can measure buyer sentiment. That's amazing. These days, this is expected You don't want sellers to manually enter things, uh, into their C- CRM after the call is over.

You want insights into how they can get better next time they pitch the same product. You all... You want all of that. And of course, it's no longer, it's no longer enough to just focus on calls because your job as a salesperson is bigger than just speaking to people on Zoom, Teams, WebEx, whatever you use.

Um, also in real life, you write emails, you decide on strategies for your accounts, you follow up with people, you create, uh, documents, business cases for them, et cetera, et cetera. So the conversation intelligence as a capability today effectively to a large degree is a commodity. You can of course do it better, you can give more insights and all of that.

But still, fundamentally, the question is can... How do we go deeper to the next level where we can uncover some insights that are not obvious, that are not table stakes today? And this is why the value level, the mindset level is so exciting because that will, will help you uncover those insights. And once you get those in- to those insights, then it's just a matter of, um, putting a program in place that will make those insights available to everyone in your organization.

And yes, we w- we'll be working with enablement teams, but also the sales leaders and revenue and sales ops leaders. They are gonna be very much involved because, like I said, AI productivity, they go hand in hand, and this is top of mind for them. So we are doing this not because we just want a new product, a new SKU.

We are doing this because it fundamentally fits the picture of the platform play that, um, that we, that we have been following for many years already.

Jesus: I think, I think the USP, I think the USP for me is clear because, you know, uh, even in on, on our, um, last, uh, report on the sales mindset that we unveil on in November in our GTC event, uh, we looked into authenticity evolving into intellectual authenticity because everyone is very looking forward into what's...

h- how AI is gonna be changing the relationship between the humans, yeah, and between seller and buyer. Um, so now making this shift using the AI to garrail- The right use of the sales mindsets to carry a specific culture, yeah, within the company. I think that's very important because if not, everyone is using AI in a different way.

And I, I know that Aviso is like a very, you know, it's a, it's a very well-organized platform and ... But you know, people is using ... Sometimes they don't use Aviso. Some of them don't, don't have Aviso yet, yeah? Uh, uh, but they have, uh, many different type of AIs and, uh, I was, I was even hearing a podcast, a very interesting podcast on what is the shadow AI used in the companies, in the b- large enterprise companies.

And you will be surprised that maybe 40, 50% of the AI that is used today in enterprises is not, uh, let's say, approved by the IT department, yeah? It's something that people is using just by their own. So I believe that there is a big concern, and we are hearing that from customers, that, um, how AI is gonna be transforming the way we do relationship with other people, with other humans, and this is fundamental for the sales, yeah?

For sales, you can have the best pro-, the best pitch, the best process, the best methodology, the best AI supporting you. If there is no trust between the two humans, it's gonna be tough. It's gonna be, it's gonna be- Yeah.

Max: Trust is, trust is gonna be paramount. Also, you just talked about, um, intellectual curiosity.

Uh, that's a good example of, uh, why a solution like this is gonna be very powerful because your research shows that intellectual curiosity is on the positive side of, as a, as a sales mindset, right? And only 10% of people, of salespeople actually sell the way buyers want them to sell. Yeah. So there is some room for improvement, as they say, right?

Absolutely. So, um, if, if therefore the research tells you you probably want to be intellectually curious, all right? And, um, to be, to be as successful as possible as a salesperson, and you want to be genuine, authentic and all that. So this product will give you an opportunity to be intellectually curious when it comes to your own selling style.

This product, in a safe environment, will tell you, "Look, Max, here is where you still have some room for improvement as an individual salesperson." Not as collectively, you know, everybody believes they are not part of this 10%, of course. It's like, you know, it's, uh, somebody else, not me- Mm-hmm ... in this 10%. But when it comes to you as an individual salesperson, sales professional, be it, um, an individual contributor or a sales leader, it doesn't matter, when you start getting this feedback, assuming you are intellectually curious, then you will appreciate almost by definition those insights- When I get those insights about myself, I don't necessarily agree, for the record, with what AI is saying.

Like, I think I'm better than what the AI pictures me, the way, the way it por- portrays me. But it does give me food for thought because if you are not intellectually curious, then you are handicapping yourself. That, that's the idea. And you are, and you're right, you don't have to buy the entire platform for this.

You can just focus on the studio. The studio will help you with the, with the sales mindset- And from there, that's- ... and the, and the value play, and then you can take it from there in whatever direction you want.

Jesus: Yeah. I mean, I, I ... Do, do ... Have you, have you heard this kind of stuff from your customers? Like, uh, like, uh, saying, you know, "Aviso platform is fantastic but then I'm worried about how the trust ... I mean, how the AI..." Because, you know, you, you, you are maybe having a relationship with a person, right? And then this person receives Aviso platform, and then the, the, the level of sales quality then jumps like a, has like a big jump because of all this platform support behind, yeah?

So, um, then, then, there might be questions from, from, from buyers saying, "Well, what, what's, what's, what's the intellectual authenticity behind that?" Yeah? I don't know if you've, you've heard about these kind of questions or not. Of course. I mean, in some of the research we've done, uh, in, uh, through November last year, we, we heard that, uh, a few times, yeah, from some C- C-suite.

Max: Yeah. Usually what happens is in the scenario that you described, okay, you introduced the platform. You start getting the insights. You start getting the guidance. You start getting the automation that you were hoping to get. And then inevitably the question comes up, "Okay, what else can we do?" Or, "Why are we seeing those insights?

What explains it?" And some of those questions would be at a more fundamental level than, "Okay, what's going on with this deal? Why is it not gonna close?" And we know it's not gonna close because AI is more accurate than human judgment. But then the question inevitably becomes, "Okay, so if I take a step back as a sales leader, I look at my sales team, um, what can I do differently for them to enable them to capture those potential, those areas where we know there is potential?

But I know it's not a matter of something tactical that needs to be done. It's a more fundamental shift that needs to happen. And I know it because it's my instinct." Usually, like, a lot of sales leaders that we work with, they have- Rely on their instincts and they know it's like, you know, if you're fundamentally at its core, if you're trying to do the right thing by your customer, then you'll be more successful.

And then of course, we have the research results from Consalia. Yeah. Yeah. 20 plus years. So they speak for themselves. Yeah. And I think this is, this is where the technology will just enable people to scale it. The, the, instead of doing a learning program or a coaching program for a subset of your, um, salespeople, you can do it at scale.

Yeah. That's why I expect the studio to be, uh, very, very popular.

Jesus: So Will, do you think, because, you know, uh, we, we, I mean, you and me were in a very interesting customer meeting with one of the biggest telcos, uh, in the world, uh, today. And then, and one of their concerns were, was about how, how you ensure that, uh, the skills you're training are embedded after the training, you know, interventions.

Yeah? So do, do, do you think that the Sales Mindset Studio, the Sales Mindset Intelligence Studio will, I mean, with this 24 by seven availability, uh, you know, kind of private assessment, et cetera, do, do you think it will help a lot into, into that space? Well,

Will: yes, I, I do Jesus. I think it'll be ... It's, it's such a, a shift in, um, in how salespeople can operate.

I mean, just by having this constant analysis and feedback based on the conversations you're having with clients, that is providing you with, um, sort of best practice suggestions. But all, everything is ta- from my understanding, everything is tailored to the individual. So it's looking at how Will Squire has engaged with, um, this person at that organization.

And over time you can see, have I, um, am I living, am I living the sales mindsets in every conversation that I'm having? Or have I dropped the ball over time and do I need to up my game? Well, I think the, the technology that Aviso provides does that, but it does it on a, in a sort of, in a live environment, which is really crucial.

It does it per, you know, conversation you're having with the, with each, um, client that you're having, uh, that conversation with. Regardless of if you're at the beginning of a com- uh, a pipeline or if you are through to negotiating at the end, um, you're, you've got a coach with you. And I think that is, I think that's completely game changing.

Um, you know, if I, if I relate it back to, to, you know, reflecting it back on myself in, in terms of the training that I've received, whether it's been through Consalia or not, you always ... When you, when you- When you're going into training, you kind of think, "Well, I'm at this level , and I'm always gonna be... I'm...

You know, this is my benchmark, and yes, I sometimes have good weeks and bad weeks and things like that. But it... I'm constantly... It's my own self-perception." Well, now in this era that we're living in, everything is gonna be quantified in data, and I think that is really exciting. It can be a bit daunting if you think about it like that.

You're constantly gonna be monitored and things, but it really is the sort of the world that we're, we're living in at the moment. And if it improves how you operate and improves how you engage with clients, that's a- that's something that you shouldn't shy away from.

Jesus: Yeah. I think our brains understand very well the data, you know?

So at the end if you have, like, a sales mindset score of, I don't know, 78, and then you are... You manage to improve over the next two or three months up to 85, and you say, "Okay, I've improved the sales mindset score, so I'm being more authentic, more client-centric," so what? But then if you can connect that and correlate that to business metrics and be better, because we see that the best sales mindsets performers are the best business metrics performers, yeah?

We, we, we've, we've proven that through all these years, so it's not just the academic research, right? So we've even done a, um, a control, uh, control groups, uh, test groups, yeah? To, to understand one trained, the other not trained, and one, one using it, one not using it. And, and we saw a massive difference, yeah?

So I, I, I believe this, this, this is a... So responding a bit on the question and summarizing on how do you sell a product that's new, uh, I think you have to have a very good U- um, uh, USP, yeah? So unique selling proposition. Uh, we definitely are responding to some of the concerns we are hearing from customers in connection with AI, in connection with, uh, uh, business, sales business training, in connection with culture as well.

There will be companies that will not be ready to change the culture or will not be looking forward to it or will not maybe understand the- The, the, the, the impact that the culture change may have, yeah? Or is maybe that, um, and there will be others that, you know, it's already embedded into, into the transformation, into the culture.

So I, I think, I think the... What we are looking into now is that, uh, these companies that are more focused on, not more focused, but I would say have a focus on sales mindsets, on the culture and the behaviors, are the companies that are trying to build for the long term, not for the m- short term, yeah. It's for the medium long term.

And I believe that, uh, now with, uh, with AI taking so much, uh, uh, so much the stage, I think we need to, uh, have a, a good focus on the human element, yeah? Because as I, I, I was asking Trevor a long time ago, one of my first questions to Trevor when I met him in London is like, "Okay, fantastic. Aviso is great.

What happens if you have two competitors competing on the same thing and both of them have Aviso?" So they, both of them have the best intelligence, the best platform. Then, then it's the human, right? So then it's the processes and the human that the ones that, uh, make the difference, and that's what, why, why, why I think, um, having this new module into the, uh, Aviso ecosystem will put, uh, Aviso as well on, on the forefront of, of the human, you know, behaviors and, and mindsets transformation.

Well, long speech. Thank you very much, guys. I don't know, do you have any final remark from, uh, from the States, uh, Max, or from, from- No, I'll just say, yes,

Max: as reacting to what you just said, it's always about the human. Whatever the tool you're using, uh, if you are using it the right way or the intentions are different, like if you're intellectually curious, for example, you will be, uh, likely more effective at using it than someone who is just doing a superficial job at this.

Yeah. Yeah. And you had any final remark?

Will: No. Max, thank you so much for joining us today. And, um, I must say I'm so looking forward to the 21st when we are kind of launching the, the partnership in London, and, um, yeah.

Jesus: Okay. Thank you very much, guys. We, we, uh, to both of you- Thank you ... and Will. Uh, we have the QR code here if you want, uh, more information, and, and there are some spots available.

So if you happen to be in, in London close to, uh, uh, Liverpool Street Station, uh, please just register and, uh, we will be happy to welcome you. Thank you. Thank you, guys.

Will: Cheers. Thank you. Bye. Bye.

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